I am very opposed to giving any type of publicity or attention to hateful and counterproductive members of our society; but, some things need to be brought to the attention of these “thinkers”.  If intellectual discourse includes hateful chants and violent rhetoric, then by all means these men are “thinkers”.  This group of second generation New Yorkers seem to be doing everything humanly possible to curb the natural conversion rates to Islam.  Subhan’Allah, Islam is by far the fastest growing religion in the world, having recently surpassed Catholicism to be the world’s largest religion— period.  Yet this Khawārij offshoot seems to take it upon themselves to, not only attack Christian and Jewish ideologies, but also attack we Shi’as.  Calling us such derogatory terms as “kufr”, that we “support prostitution, and are sympathetic towards transsexuals.    They attempt to put forth the front that they are from Ahlul Sunnah wa Jam’aa; but Ahlul Sunnah accept Imam Ali ibn Abi Taleb(as).  If we Shia are kufr, then the Islamic Thinkers Society are hypocrites.  Go ask your politician Sheiks which of these two are worse titles to carry.  Further– don’t associate yourselves with the mainstream Islamic School of Thought.  By doing so, you are just trying to make fitnah and sow discord and schism within Islam.  Your fundamentalist Wahhabi-inspired method of thinking is very dangerous and leads you down a path that is not siraat al mustaqeem.  I have looked at your charges towards the Shia School of Thought (via your poorly written flier) and it only further leads me to conclude you have never studied outside of what you now believe to be true:

  • Mut’aa is in the Qur’an (4:24).  If you want to follow umr (LA), and make bid’aa against the Glorious Qur’an then do that– but you will be kufr.  No one’s ruling trumps the Qur’an and you know it like we do.
  • Taqiyya is in the Qur’an (3:28; 16:106).  We will be the first to agree with you that the Shirazi’s have misused and misunderstood the tafseer for the application of taqiyya.  Yet, this does not negate this choice given to us by Allah(swt) and if you think you can overrule the Qur’an with your bid’aa, you are gravely incorrect. 
      “[Yusuf Ali 16:106] Any one who, after accepting faith in Allah, utters Unbelief, except under compulsion, his heart remaining firm in Faith, but such as open their breast to Unbelief, on them is Wrath from Allah, and theirs will be a dreadful Penalty.”

      “[Yusuf Ali 3:28] Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah: except by way of precaution, that ye may Guard yourselves from them. But Allah cautions you (To remember) Himself; for the final goal is to Allah.”

      Ibn Kathir says:“(unless you indeed fear a danger from them) meaning, except those believers who in some areas or times fear for their safety from the disbelievers. In this case, such believers are allowed to show friendship to the disbelievers outwardly, but never inwardly.For instance, Al-Bukhari recorded that Abu Ad-Darda’ said, “We smile in the face of some people although our hearts curse them. Al-Bukhari said that Al-Hasan said, “The Taqiyya is allowed until the Day of Resurrection

As far as your calling Iran the “transsexual revolution”, I pity your misunderstanding.  Khomeini allowed sex changes for people that were born transgendered– not for the people that you’ve partied with in the streets of New York during their parades.  What did you accomplish by being so close to these disgusting individuals?  Did you change them?  Of course not.  All you did was take your precious time to be near them.

We, at ShiaCrescent.Com formally accept your challenge to refute the weak claims in your flier, as well as formally challenge you to a public debate.  You could chant “Khaybar, khaybar” to Jews living in America, yet you are so quick to forget who was the standard-bearer of the Islamic Army and champion of that battle.  Go read on what the Prophet Muhammed (sawas) says about those who do not accept Imam Ali(as).  Maybe this will make you rethink some of your “positions”.

I promise if you accept the challenge we will embarrass you more thoroughly than Glenn Beck did.  You claim to be intellectuals.  So we shall see.


Peace be upon those who deserve it.

5 Responses to “Islamic Thinkers Society ? Really?”

  1. Hussien Ali Saleh Says:

    Well done my friend…well done!

  2. Islamic Thinkers Society Says:

    First of all your criteria is batil to begin with, so why delve further into a debate? From the beginning of the article you sound like a jaahil moderate who uses the kufr surroundings to make up judgment using their terminologies,etc. The challenge was thrown an Al-Khoie center at NYC primarily and they haven’t responded back. Second of all, you reference ayats of the Qur’an without giving any details as to what words are the qareena(indicators) for what you claim. From this standpoint, it can be obviously seen that you have no comprehensive understanding of it, much less what your scholars say. Thirdly, you claim Khomeini(l.a.) only made exception for those who were born as a hermaphrodite, but are you 100% sure of that? There are documentaries which show the sexually disphoriated individuals taking advantage of this so-called fatwa. Your style of argument and the so-called attempt to debate is not worth our time. We rather debate with those who know their books, not those who deal with jaahil terms such as ‘schism’ and ‘sowing discord’ and those who do not know how to properly use terminologies such as kufr(act of disbelief) and kaafireen(pl. disbelievers). Go read the article you wrote again understand what this means.

  3. Nom de Guerre Says:

    The only thing batil was your response. You have avoided all points we’ve made, offered counter “arguments” which are completely futile and unfounded (you want qareena? you will get more than you can handle in our in-depth response to all your ignorant charges within your flier). The Al-Khoie Center may have more important agenda to fulfill, but we have no problem at all refuting all your “points” in that flier. I reference plain and evident proof of concepts that are clearly contained within the Qur’an that your group has declared null and haraam. This is bid’aa. I even linked to our very thorough article explaining the concept further. This was just an introduction, habibi; read a few articles here if you want to see how researched our topics are and to what extent proof is given to support the Truth. For someone to claim we have no understanding when our articles offer reference to Qur’an and Hadith (that you accept), while your articles are just generic hate-filled undergraduate rhetoric– this is something which can only make me smile. I have also watched the (western) documentary about Khomeini(RA 🙂 ). To answer: yes, I am 100% sure of this. For you to be so against zionist media groups, but to accept what is said about Khomeini(RA) as dogma– this just furthers the truth that you are hypocrites. Your entire identity– hypocrites. Yelling “Freedom of Speech”, and in the same breath “Khaybar, Khaybar!”. By Allah(swt), you are such potent hypocrites it should be bottled and sold for concentrate. What you are doing is exactly this– creating schism and sowing discord within the Ummah. If someone takes the Shahada and follows the Book, it no longer falls upon you to judge whether or not that person is a Muslim. This is left to Allah(swt), alone. I accept your forfeit from the debate. It is clear from your “retort” here that you genuinely are not even worth our time. This is besides the point now, however, as we are still going to formally shred that weak flier. Hopefully half as justly as when Imam Ali(AS) shredded Al-Hareth(LA) and Marhab(LA), at….where was it? Oh yeah…Khaybar. I do not know how to properly use the terms you’ve used, you mean? I’ve used all the terms in the context, verbatim, that you have provided them in. Go install the Arabic language pack if you want to get formal here.

    Next time you are out standing in the rain with homosexuals– consider opening a book before you open your mouth. If you want to make this an ad hominem mindwalk, we can play that game too. Just please, no profanity. It’s not becoming of your message. Islam is a religion– not grounds for colonialism or the pretext for an aggressive war. Crusading is a Christian phenomena, brother. Islamically, there is no compulsion in religion; yet all your group proves to be is a yelling, screaming, primitive, missionary sect. I love how you’ve ignored the important points of my article– namely, how Islam is experiencing spikes in growth at record numbers–NATURALLY. People convert by coming to logic, faith, and Truth– not by force and “militant” chants in the streets. In all honesty– has anyone approached you during one of these rants and was compelled to learn more about Islam? If what you are ultimately doing is turning potential curious/possible reverters away, then are you damaging Islam or benefitting it? These are the paramount questions you need to be asking yourself if you claim to be authentic “thinkers”. Think about it.

  4. Ali Hodroje Says:

    I have to say Glenn Beck to their spokesman apart,
    I was cringing for half of the interveiw

  5. Ali Hodroje Says:

    I have to say Glenn Beck tore their spokesman apart,
    I was cringing for half of the interveiw.

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